The Rings of Power Season 2’s finale is here at last, and it brings with it major developments for all the Lord of the Rings show’s heroes and villains – including Míriel and Nori.

The Escapist recently caught up with The Rings of Power stars Cynthia Addai-Robinson and Markella Kavenagh to talk about Míriel and Nori’s final scenes in Season 2, as well as their hopes for Season 3.

[Note: This interview has been edited for clarity.]

Míriel makes some big decisions in The Rings of Power Season 2, Episode 8. Not only does she stay put to face trial in Númenor, but she also sends Elendil off to Middle-earth with his legendary sword, Narsil. Is it fair to say that – somewhat ironically, given her condition – she now has a clear vision of what her and Elendil’s separate destinies should be?

Cynthia Addai-Robinson: Yeah, I think it is fair to say that. And that’s certainly the intention in terms of the element of blindness and what that allegorically was meant to represent for [Míriel] and her arc this season. I feel like her conviction and her decision to stay is not necessarily about just being relegated to a prison cell or being resigned to her fate. I think it’s an active choice and she’s still very much thinking ahead to next steps – whatever those next steps may be – and, obviously, this newfound trust and dynamic [with] Elendil and really seeing in him a future leader.

He very much was her eyes at the beginning of the season, so that by the end, she is teaching him all the things he’s going to need down the road. And obviously, [there’s] this very significant passing along of Narsil, for those who know the lore and know the role that sword plays. But I also felt that the moment needed to still work for people who do not know what that sword is significant for. Really, it’s sort of a passing along of responsibilities and she very much is making a choice, with plans still formulating.

There’s a parting of ways for Nori in The Rings of Power Season 2’s finale, as well. She says goodbye to the Stranger as she sets off to guide the Stoors’ big migration. On her way out, Nori pushes back on the idea that she and the Stranger are all that different. What do you think she sees as their underlying similarities?

Markella Kavenagh: That’s a really interesting question. I think for Nori, something that always felt really true in regards to their dynamic is that from the second that she meets the Stranger, she recognises this [shared] desire to be understood and a desire to be heard. Every time she’s offered up an idea or has expressed how curious she is about the outside world, the Harfoot community hasn’t really entertained it and has dismissed it quite quickly.

So, for the Stranger and her, I think at the very end they both are very curious. I’m not going to speak to the Stranger too much because that’s for [Stranger actor] Dan [Weyman], but there is a lot of curiosity. And then I also think that they both really want to fight for a better world. So, she’s just really acknowledging that and highlighting that, and recognising that [while] they both have their own journeys, their values are really similar and their morals are really similar.

Given where the Season 2 finale leaves Míriel and Nori, what are your hopes for your characters in The Rings of Power Season 3?

Addai-Robinson: My hope is that, again, there’s an understanding that [Míriel] is an intelligent queen, somebody who was literally reared her entire life to ultimately one day lead. Now, that gets thwarted [in Season 2], but she’s no less intelligent, she’s no less understanding of human behaviour, of human nature. So, I want to see her outsmart Pharazôn, you know? I think there’s a way that she can lead him to believe that he has one over on her. Ultimately, I want her to prevail even within the tragic story of Númenor. As long as there’s still an understanding [in Season 3] that she is in her own power, even if externally it’s not the case, [then I’ll be happy]. I think that trial by the sea [in Season 2, Episode 6] sort of solidified something for her, so I would want that to continue.

Kavenagh: I just want Nori to continue being as adventurous [as in Season 2] and I’d love her to meet maybe another character at some point [laughs]. If that’s possible, if that makes sense for her journey. But I really want her to continue honoring what she believes is the right path and going there and just being unapologetically herself.

The Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power Season 2 is currently streaming on Prime Video.

Elendil remains squarely in the spotlight in The Rings of Power Season 2’s sixth installment, “Where Is He?”, going on trial not once, but twice! It’s a dramatic turn of events that promises major repercussions for the Lord of the Rings show’s future.

The Escapist recently caught up with star Lloyd Owen for the full lowdown on Elendil’s biggest moments in Episode 6, including his defiant courtroom outburst, his “impossible” romance with Míriel, and what it all means for the ex-sea captain’s series-long journey towards the throne of Gondor.

[Note: This interview has been edited for clarity.]

Elendil essentially goes on trial twice in Episode 6. The first time, it seems as though he’ll kowtow to Ar-Pharazôn during his trial, however, he ultimately denounces him as a traitor and declares Míriel Númenor’s true ruler. Can you talk through Elendil’s mindset in that scene?

Yeah, good question. He’s under instructions from Míriel [since] Episode 5 where she feels because of his vision within the palantír that that’s changed the course of history. And what we’ve seen of Elendil so far is a man of duty and responsibility, and a man whose faith gets like –you know, in Season 1, when the leaves of the Nimloth Tree come on, there’s a connection to him and Míriel. And because of the Galadriel influence, that deep instinct within him, that sort of Elven instinct, is reawakened after many, many years.

And so, in that situation, he has followed his, if we call that his heart, if you like – his Faithful heart – and he’s done that alongside Míriel. Therefore, he follows her instruction, because he trusts the hierarchy of her position. His queen’s giving him an order. He’s a soldier; he understands that. And so that’s when he, even though he raises his arm to [Pharazôn’s son] Kemen, he doesn’t fight anymore.

But it’s the moment [in Episode 6] where essentially Pharazôn is asking him to renounce his faith, that’s a different concept to him, I think. So, whereas it was his intention to bow to Pharazôn, [to do] whatever was needed to keep the ship steady – the “Ship of Númenor” as Míriel views it, at this point – he would have done it. But he’s asked a question that is antithetical to its faith. I think that’s why he finally says no – that he can’t do it. And actually, what’s interesting about that is that the balance of hierarchy power between him and Míriel slightly changes because he’s got that solid “believer” feeling, and that’s unimpeachable.

You can’t challenge the fact that I’ve been told by my faith what to do. It’s clear for him that is the end of his life if the gods will it, if the Valar will it. It’s quite a powerful position for him.

Despite the first trial’s outcome, Elendil’s daughter Eärien remains firmly entrenched in Camp Pharazôn. At the same time, she clearly doesn’t want her father to die during the second, trail-by-sea ritual. She’s desperate to get through to him, but does Elendil still think he has a chance of getting through to her?

Great question. When she comes – and we work quite hard at this – but I think when [Eärien] comes to visit [Elendil] in that dungeon scene, she’s very much in the politician mode. She’s telling him that he’s got to change his mind, almost like a bit of an order, but then obviously, she’s gonna be emotional about the fact that her father’s not gonna do that, and he’s gonna die.

It’s almost like a parental lesson for her, if you think of it that way. It’s the most loving thing to do to her is to say “I will demonstrate for you what having integrity, what self-sacrifice is, and how it’s important to hold on tight to your principles. And if that means losing my life, then that’s what I’m going to do.” And I think her breaking down at that point, I kind of hope it would undo him. You know, the relief of having his – I don’t know whether you got any of this in watching [Episode 6], because what you do on the day and what ends up on [the screen] is a different thing – but I was hoping was that there was some sort of relief that he’s got his girl back. She’s finally come back to him, the little baby he used to comfort.

And when she cries in his arms and then she very quickly gets back to sort of taking the Pharazôn party line and there’s just no chance. She’s gone, she’s drunk the Kool-Aid and there’s no persuading her, is the position he finds himself in. Untouchable. Look, I mean, if you had four seasons just on Eärien and Elendil, there might have been a longer conversation to have with her to try and win her over. But I just think in that moment it’s like she’s so far gone, he doesn’t know where to start.

But Eärien obviously also brings Míriel to see Elendil, hoping that she’ll be able to talk him around. It’s another of The Rings of Power Season 2’s hints that maybe his relationship with Míriel runs deeper than simply a loyal subject and his queen. How would you describe Elendil’s feelings for Míriel at this point in Season 2?

First of all, given what I just said about the Eärien thing, what’s amazing is that she brings in her mortal enemy in the shape of Míriel because she thinks that she might persuade [her] dad not to kill himself tomorrow. Essentially, right? Which again shows how much she loves her father. And I think from Míriel’s perspective, this is a love that sort of can’t happen. Not because it’s illicit or they’re married, it’s just that for Elendil, the hierarchy is such, the sense of queen/subject [or] queen/soldier is a thing that’s impossible [to overcome] as far as he’s concerned.

But [a romantic relationship with Míriel] is also impossible because of where he is. He’s grieving, hugely, his wife. This is a bit we’ve invented for [The Rings of Power], but his wife has died. He’s this widowed father and his wife has died. And I think it’s one of those ones where he’s not sure that she feels the same as him and she’s not sure that he feels the same as her, but they know they have this connection that is emotional in the sense that they need each other desperately. They’re both isolated because they were the ones that took responsibility for the decision [to lead Númenor’s ill-fated expedition to Middle-earth in Season 1].

There’s a safe area of discussing your feelings around faith that’s not intimate, if you know what I mean? It has a safer intimacy, put it that way. But I think they both feel it, and whether they could ever openly admit it is a very different question.

You get a real sense of the lessons Elendil and Míriel learn from each other in The Rings of Power Season 2. You see it in Episode 6, when Míriel faces the trail-by-sea in Elendil’s place. That’s very much her moment, and he wants to be her moment – holding her out as “Tar-Míriel” – is it also an important part of laying the ground for Elendil’s own journey to the throne, as the future King of Gondor depicted in The Lord of the Rings?

Yes, it’s – the hope, I suppose, with the show from and my personal, selfish Elendil perspective is you watch how a leader gets made as opposed to born. So, [Míriel] teaches him a lot about the court. We see that in the funeral of her father, he’s having to be her eyes. So, he’s learning about these various things.

I assume the great leaders have a humility about them, which I certainly sense in Elendil. But I think in that moment where he shouts her name, Tar-Míriel, that feels [like] political smarts because it’s like, “Let’s whip this crowd up and let’s try and get that rebellion going,” even if that’s not what Míriel wants.

So, you’re right, that is where that sense of [Elendil’s future comes in] – because every character in Tolkien, if you read The Lord of the Rings, every one of them talks about their fate, every character in Middle-earth has this sort of sense that they’re on a path which is kind of inexorable. I think those are those things that drive him, you know?

Even though he doesn’t know where he’s going to end up, there’s something about this innate leadership, this sense of faith and duty that is a deeper instinct than he can consciously describe. But that’s pushing him and driving him [in Season 2], yeah.

The Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power Season 2 is currently streaming on Prime Video, with new episodes dropping Thursdays.

The Escapist: I just wanted to start by congratulating you on your upcoming New York Off-Broadway debut!

Felicia Day: Thank you so much! I’m so thrilled. It’s been a dream my whole life to do a play in New York. And what better subject than improvised Dungeons & Dragons?

I wanted to ask how this came together, the origin story of your collaboration with The Twenty-Sided Tavern.

I wish it could be a little more clever, but I had been seeing their ads online and thinking that I gotta get to New York to watch that and see it myself as a fan. And they reached out and said they’re now thinking about having guests and they would love me to be their premiere guest. I couldn’t have said yes faster!

It does seem like a match made in heaven! And you’re in this inaugural class of guests with Aabria Iyengar and Erika Ishii, but you’re the first one up to bat. How does it feel being the first?

I feel like I’m always the first at a lot of things. I like to pioneer things. And for some reason, as a very anxious person, I love diving headfirst into things I don’t understand or know or am well-versed at.

Although, I guess I am very well-versed at D&D. I’m very well-versed at improv. So, I have a leg up on this more than most things I do.

That kinda leads into what I was gonna ask next, which is that you have a ton of actual play experience. How do you think that has prepared you for this? And in what ways do you think what’s going on at The Twenty-Sided Tavern will deviate from your previous actual play experience?

Well, I have some briefing on what the show is like, but I have a suspicion that once I’m on that incredibly gorgeous stage and sitting there and the audience is telling me what choices they want me to make – I think it’s gonna be even more fun because we’re all just doing it together. The audience isn’t passively watching; they’re participating. I just get to goof off as a character that they help me choose. It’s really much more interactive than I even thought from reading the reviews and firsthand experiences and the ads.

I’m just thrilled to be able to do this collaborative storytelling with everybody!

I’ve been doing improv since the beginning of my career. I hate to say how long that is, but I will say that The Guild, my web series about gamers, came out of improv. Two of the people in the cast of The Guild, Sandeep Parikh and Jeff Lewis, who play Zaboo and Vork, I wrote those parts for them based on the fact that they always made me break up on the improv stage. And we still have an improv group that occasionally meets and performs in Los Angeles, which I did just a couple of months ago.

I can’t tell you how excited I am to be able to play on a stage in this environment with this vocabulary and these wonderfully nerdy fans.

I wanted to ask a little about your role as the Mage. I know things vary at The Twenty-Sided Tavern from show to show, but is there anything you can share about what you’re looking forward to from playing the Mage?

Well, I don’t want to give any spoilers as to what kinds of characters I may play, but there are multiple characters I could play as the Mage. And the audience gets to choose, essentially. So, I get thrown a character, and I get to play that character for the whole evening. And I love that sort of variety because I know that, even if I was playing the same character every night for my eight performances, it would be different every night. But I know it’s going to be extra exciting because I don’t know what accent I’ll be using or what physicality or what attitude, and it’s gonna make it so much more fun.

In the past couple years, D&D has had the Dungeons & Dragons movie and Baldur’s Gate 3, these adaptations that have both been really appealing and successful for long-time fans of the franchise but have also been really welcoming to new audiences. So, I was curious if you could talk a little bit about how you think the stage makes a unique atmosphere to welcome new audiences to D&D?

When I first started doing D&D, I was riveted by how collaborative and fun it was to play with my friends. I did it through a sketchwriting comedy group. We started doing weekly D&D, and I gotta tell you, some of those sessions made me laugh more than anything has in my life.

So, I always knew it was a performer’s medium. That’s why when I was at my old company Geek & Sundry and I wanted to start a Twitch channel, I knew people playing D&D on Twitch live would be compelling and exciting live entertainment, even though a lot of people told me that would not be the case.

So, what I’m excited about is that [The Twenty-Sided Tavern] is taking it to a whole new level of performance, of immersion, of interaction. And I think it’s really clever and something where the audience will never feel like they aren’t ready to participate. Having that extra barrier of the fourth wall broken completely, and the audience could literally be on stage with us. I think that’s really exciting. And it makes me as a performer more eager to make big choices and make everyone laugh. And, well, probably not cry. Only when I roll a one. Only when I have a critical failure.

There’s room for a little bit of tragedy in D&D, mixed in with the comedy.

Exactly! So, if you come into The Twenty-Sided Tavern and you’ve never played D&D before, the rules are gonna be laid out very simply. And I think people might feel like: “Hey, this is actually really fun, maybe I want to try it!.” Versus being intimidated by any of the guardrails that we have. Guardrails are just there – I mean, really, limitations make you more creative.

So, yeah, I’m excited to introduce people who’ve never done D&D to D&D and then also just make all the people who know how to play the game delighted with how this has been exploded onto the stage.

Speaking of the explosion of it, The Twenty-Sided Tavern has been so successful, and then you see Critical Role and Dimension 20 selling out these big arenas for their live shows. How do you feel you’d define the era of D&D we’re in right now?

I think it’s a performer’s medium. It’s taking live performance and improv, cause essentially it is always improv, this is really taking improv, and I know that a lot of the groups that you mentioned have actors who have improv and performance backgrounds, these are trained professionals doing this in this format, and I think it just enhances live performance and connection with audience. Improv is a very niche entertainment. I don’t know if you were just a regular person off the street if you would be like “Let’s go see a comedy improv show”. Same thing with D&D. But when you combine the two you have a topspin that’s really very attractive to bringing people who are curious about how this could come to be into the theater.

And, you know, passively watching a play is wonderful. Passively watching a musical is wonderful. But, we’re in an era where audiences are used to interacting with their entertainment. They’re used to reacting online to what they’ve seen. They’re used to watching live performances online, especially over COVID. I think that vocabulary and that method of interacting with your entertainment is probably something that people kind of want in real life as well. And I think this is probably scratching that itch.

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And I feel like you helped lay the groundwork for where we are now with what you did at Geek & Sundry, with bringing all these TTRPG shows to a new audience.

I mean, I’m blessed. I’m blessed to be involved in it, and I just admire all the people who’ve made it explode to a level that I never could have imagined.

And now I’m in my performer era. I just want to perform. I just want to play with people. I’m done being the behind-the-scenes mama, and I’m ready to play.

Take the stage, literally.

Exactly, take the stage.

I wanted to ask about the cross-section of Broadway and tabletop. If you could play or run a TTRPG set in the world of any Broadway show, which show would you choose?

Oh, that’s a really – oh, Cats! That would be a hot mess of a night. I would love to do that!

That would be incredible!

Sweeney Todd would be pretty good, too.

There’s a lot of room in the Broadway world for a lot of fun TTRPG stories.

I mean, that’s what’s wonderful about Broadway!

I’m working on stage things myself, so the stage has been on my mind. And just having this be able to be the start of a bunch of projects in a live venue is really wonderful.

That’s great! Are you able to speak a little to the things you’re working on?

We have a Guild musical that hopefully we’ll be doing a staged reading online of pretty soon.

That’s really exciting!

Yeah, I’m really excited.

I wanted to talk about The Twenty-Sided Tavern and how it celebrates the 50^th anniversary of [Dungeons & Dragons]. What are some things you hope to see in the future of the game? In the next 50 years?

Oh, wow! I mean, that’s a hard thing, because the formula works so well. Right?

You could evolve the edition a little bit with different rules and all that, but what’s most exciting is that people are using the format and the rules to be able to make their own modules and homebrew and things like that.

I mean, I love the Jane Austen RPG. I love Shadowrun. I love a good tavern, believe me, that’s my favorite. That’s always my baseline. But, I also love the fact that people are seeing the idea that structured play is a benefit and enjoyable to adults as well. I think that’s one of the things that we lost in our lives. We passively consume so much, right? And active play is where we get our creative juices flowing and we light up with that sort of like whatever it is, dopamine?

It’s collaborating with people. And I just like the fact that D&D and other RPGs give everyone the format to feel safe to play.

Absolutely. I feel like TTRPGs in general are also a great way to collaboratively problem-solve with people. And a great way to meet people too, like if you don’t know someone already, getting in the weeds with them of telling a story.

Yeah, if they’re a jerk around the gaming table, they’re gonna be a jerk in real life.

The red flags are there.

The red flags are there!

So, you’re going to New York for the show. Is there anything you’re particularly excited to do while you’re in the city aside from The Twenty-Sided Tavern?

I have not been to New York in quite a while.

I’m looking forward to having dinner with my collaborators for The Guild musical. I’ve actually never met them in person, but we’ve been working on this thing for four or five years. So, that’ll be exciting. They are hardcore theater people, and I’m excited just to treat them to dinner.

I just love New York. I love walking around. I’m sad there’s been no excuse for me to go. And I hope it’s not going to be too hot because I just love walking. I’ve got my HOKAs on, and I intend to just take in as much as I can. I don’t think I’m going to be able to see any other plays, so I think I’ll just be laying the groundwork for coming back. Maybe this Fall, to see the leaves change and see some wonderful theater and shove it in my eyeballs.

So, for The Guild musical, are you planning to stage that in New York to start?

You know, we don’t have any plans except to do a staged reading to raise funds to maybe put it on and do a short run. This is a new world for me, so we’ll be looking for producers to help. It’d be great to do it in New York, but right now, we’re doing one step at a time and that will be a sort of online reading at a local LA theater with an online component of people being able to watch the truncated version of it to raise money for an actual production. So, we’ll see.

And is the plan to bring back the cast of the original series as well for that?

You know, I don’t think any of them sing. So, it’s gonna be me and some new friends. But they’ve all given their blessing, and I’ve been working on a reunion movie, hopefully to kickstart next year. So, they’re gonna be happy for that one with no singing.

I mean, they sang a little in [The Guild] music videos you did back in the day.

You know, it was actually just me. If you actually go look back. [Laughs] I love them.

Speaking of singing. There’s not too much of that in The Twenty-Sided Tavern, but is there a Broadway [musical] in your mind that would be a dream to do?

Oh my gosh, that’s really hard. I love super old-school ones.

Into the Woods. Into the Woods, I actually did in college, and I would love to do Into the Woods.

What role were you in the college production?

I was the evil stepsister, but I understudied Cinderella. That was fantastic.

I just like the old cheesy ones like Brigadoon and Oklahoma!. For me, the cheesy ones like Carousel, like all those are my favorite. I watched the movies when I was a kid, and that’s how I fell in love with musicals. I didn’t really go to them.

There are so many wonderful old plays, but also new ones. I just love people discovering how awesome live theater is but also the catalog of creativity that’s there.

I feel like there have been a lot of new shows that have helped usher new audiences in.

Yeah, I really wanna see the Stereophonic! That would be the one I would try to nab if I had time in New York.

What else do you have coming up this fall that you’re excited about?

I’ve been doing small things here and there. The film industry is very slow right now, and that’s given me the opportunity to work on my writing. I have a one-woman show I’m working on, a novel, all my writing is going at a good pace. I’ve been doing a lot of book narration and podcast performance and voice-over. And then I have several shorts and movies that are doing film festival routes.

So, I’ve been really, really busy in a really wonderful way because I’ve been getting to do a lot more indie stuff and really getting back to, again, my writing. I’m finally over my trauma. Of becoming a mother, of leaving my company, you know, all these things. It was a big chunk of time I took off for a lot of personal reasons, and I feel finally like I’m in a good creative place and I just can’t wait to make the things that I love.

I feel like The Guild really struck a chord with people because it came from such a personal experience and from your voice, so it sounds like you’re ready to start telling those kinds of stories again.

One hundred percent. I have some things coming out next year that are pretty big, that I put my heart into. You know, COVID I think put us all on our back foot for a lot of reasons, and that was right after I left my company and had a baby, and just it was a lot to go through as a person. I really feel like I’m on the other side of something and I can get to a new phase of my life as a creator. Really just focus on the stories I want to tell, which there are many.

Yeah, it sounds like we’re gonna be in a new era of creative storytelling from you, which is exciting!

Yay, thanks!

Is there anything else you wanna say before we leave about The Twenty-Sided Tavern?

I’d just love fans to come out and see it, you know. I think that it’s gonna be a delight to anyone who goes. And I am so proud of being able to be a part of the crew and to improvise. It’s my two loves combined and I really, really hope everyone comes to pack the house and see up play and make merry!

I think we’re gonna have a good party together!

Felicia Day checks into The Twenty-Sided Tavern September 19 through 24, with a special talkback after the September 22 evening performance. Tickets are available on the Dungeons & Dragons show’s official website.

What Is HYPERCHARGE: Unboxed?

HYPERCHARGE: Unboxed is a family-friendly first-person shooter brought to life by six friends in the indie scene, and while it’s been available on PC and Nintendo Switch, it saw massive success with the launch of its Xbox port. Featuring Split-Screen multiplayer, online firefights, and just bringing an impeccable vibe to a genre that feels cut-and-paste, HYPERCHARGE: Unboxed is the perfect throwback to FPS games of yesteryear.

After working behind the scenes for nearly two years trying to make his dream a reality, Joe Henson never stopped believing in the phrase “Power Your Dreams.” Now, after pouring sweat and tears into this passion project, HYPERCHARGE: Unboxed is available on the platform, and I had the opportunity to speak with Henson about what helped him bring this project to life.

The Escapist: Are there any specific games that made you fall in love with gaming and game design?

Joe Henson: Oh, definitely! Counter-Strike 1.6 was my first real love in gaming. That’s where it all began for me – it holds a very special place in my heart! The endless fun times I had playing with friends and family at LAN centres are some of my fondest memories. It wasn’t just about the game; it was the whole experience that made it magical.

As for game design, Half-Life 1 and TimeSplitters 2 were the games that really got me curious about how games could tell stories and introduce complex mechanics. They’re amazing games that helped shape my understanding of what gaming could be.

Can you tell me more about your journey into game design and marketing from painting and decorating?

Starting in the family business right out of school at 15 was a safe harbour during a tough time. After being bullied throughout school, the familiarity and support of the family environment helped me manage my anxiety. While it wasn’t my passion, it taught me invaluable skills like customer relations, project management, and the importance of preparation – skills that would later be crucial in my gaming career.

Though I loved working with my family, and I’ll be forever grateful for those magical years, my heart was always in gaming. Every evening after work, no matter how exhausted, I’d dive into playing games, experimenting with game design tools, or watching game development videos. Over time, I started building fan sites for the games I loved. This became more than a hobby; it turned into a significant networking tool. Developers started reaching out to thank me for my work on these sites, which led to friendships and professional connections within the industry. I didn’t realize it at the time, but each interaction was building my future.

It was through these connections and friendships formed around the fan sites that I met my closest friends. Together, we eventually started our own adventure/indie studio, Digital Cybercherries, in 2015. We launched our first commercial title together in 2016, called New Retro Arcade: Neon, and the rest is history! I juggled both the family business and my gaming endeavors until 2020 when I finally made the full transition to work in the gaming industry full-time. Reflecting on this journey, it’s clear how every step, every connection, and every late night contributed to where I am today. From brushes to pixels, every moment has shaped my path in ways I could have never anticipated.

How did the name Digital Cybercherries Limited come to be?

Coming up with the name was actually pretty funny. We all just threw out random words and names and then voted on which ones we liked best. In the end, Digital Cybercherries won!

Related: Call of Duty: Black Ops 6 Will Hit Xbox Game Pass on Day 1

What games and movies served as inspiration for HYPERCHARGE: Unboxed?

Well, Small Soldiers is the biggest inspiration – what a movie! We also drew a lot from Toy Story, Honey I Shrunk the Kids, and The Indian in the Cupboard. On the gaming side, we were inspired by the rat maps from Counter-Strike 1.6, Sarge’s Heroes, Toy Commander, Halo, and even TimeSplitters 2!

When you were younger, were you Team Commando Elite or Gorgonite?

I was Team Gorgonite. Archer’s quote, “Just because you can’t see something, doesn’t mean it isn’t real,” has always stuck with me. It reminds me that the most important things in life – like love, hope, and dreams – aren’t always visible, but they shape who we are and how we see the world. This quote has helped me stay positive and believe in the unseen magic around us.

Why do you think HYPERCHARGE is succeeding so much on Xbox compared to other platforms? It’s right below Call of Duty on the Xbox Store’s most popular paid games right now.

I think it’s because HYPERCHARGE is really family-friendly and easy to pick up, especially with its full split-screen support. Plus, it really clicks with those of us born in the late ’80s and ’90s. It brings back a lot of good memories. It’s also a simple, classic-style shooter that many of us ’90s kids have been missing!

Are there plans for more HYPERCHARGE content, or are you already starting work on the next project?

While nothing is set in stone, we do have plans for a new Endless Game mode and maybe some other quality-of-life updates to improve certain aspects of the game. We’ll share more details soon!

What do you think that little Joe Henson would say if he could see where you are today?

Wow, this question really got to me! It made me tear up.

You know, when I was younger, I always had a small spark of hope, a tiny belief in myself that kept me going. But the saddest part is that he probably wouldn’t believe it. Given how low I felt back then, I don’t think he could even imagine it being possible.

If you’re hoping to pick up a copy of HYPERCHARGE: Unboxed for yourself, it’s available on Xbox One, Xbox Series X|S, Nintendo Switch, and PC.

Kevin Cloud started at id Software in 1992 as an artist. Now he’s a co-owner, having worked on almost every game id’s ever made.

Here are the bits of our conversation that didn’t fit into the feature interview.

***

On independent games: “When I look at the types of games that are popping up all over the place – from cell phone games to online games over the internet – there’s tons of possibilities; small companies coming up with a cool idea and getting it to the market really fast. I think from that perspective you can probably be more successful [now] than ever before. Even our most successful titles in shareware weren’t real, successful compared to retail titles.

“It’s definitely a different type pf thing than making these 3 and 4 year titles. So I think a team of guys can get out there and make one of these browser games or one of these smaller games for a handheld and really get themselves started, just like id did. I don’t see any reason why you can’t do that today any different than we did it back in the 90s.”

On Enemy Territory: Quake Wars: Enemy Territory … really evolved from Return to Castle Wolfenstein multiplayer, which was very successful and got some nice awards and people played it for a long time. That gameplay was focused on teamwork. The goal was to create character classes based around the way people like to play.

Some people are really good at shooting and some people are better at strategy and some people just want to get in and have fun. They may not be the best shot, but they still want to have fun. I wanted to create a game in which people are all working towards this common goal. When you’re in a map, you’re not spreading yourself out, you’re working together as a team.

In terms of some of the design elements, al lot of them just came from the things that we wanted to do in Wolfenstein, but couldn’t because the technology couldn’t support it or because the design itself wouldn’t support it.

[For example], in Wolfenstein, you have a tank, but the tank is basically on a path. We were dying that whole game development to make the tank not on a path so that we could drive it around. When we looked at what the character classes could do, we had the field ops that could drop air strikes. We thought … it would be cool if we could drop in real artillery … adding in some more strategy elements into the game. So that’s where the elements came from, and it was a smooth continuation for one game to the next.

On id’s audience: Our focus still remains on action games. With Orcs and Elves or some of our cell phone games, I think our audience may shift. … I think with Wolfenstein we might get a slightly different audience than with quake Wars, but as far as our main focus, we’re focused on action games, and the people that are attracted to those types of games are what we’re going to get.

When I look at our next technology and what the potential for that is … we wanted to make something with great tools in it to make it easier to get great ideas in the game. We wanted something that was a multi-platform solution … right out of the box. The unique texturing solution that John’s come up with is a nice scalable solution, so the artists don’t have to worry about whether or not they’re working on a PS3 or 360 or PC – it all just works.

We’re looking at ourselves today, where id, say 6 years ago or more, was primarily a PC developer, I’d say today we are straight down the path of being a multi-platform developer. We’re going to develop one game that works great for all players on all platforms. I think that’s gonna expand our audience or make it a little bit different, but I think in terms of the types of games we’re going to deliver, we’re focused on delivering great, in your face, fun, visceral action shooters. That’s what we do.

***

Next page: Epic’s legal troubles, the state of the industry and John Carmack

On the Epic’s legal troubles, and id Tech 5: What we’re good at is making technologies for games, and John is known for being the best in the industry at making great rendering solutions. His technology is easy to work with for making the game run very well and very effectively.

It’s not all things for all people, so that gives us the opportunity, when people come see the technology, to let them make the decision on whether or not this is going to work for them. Our goals are not to license to everybody, but to provide a good licensing solution to people who see believe it’s going to be great for the type of game they’re making.

The thing about the unique texturing solution is that it fundamentally breaks the boundaries for the artists. They can create anything they want t create.

Artists have been working with limitation for a very long time, and they create a universe that is fundamentally tiled out of textures that are repeated, and they go back in and cover up the fact at it is tiled with decals and different overlays. And that creates more geometry and more overhead and slows down the game. Basically they’re trying to do something in real time that they can do better prior to that in the data they create.

And that’s a huge opportunity for our tech to create a completely unique outside terrain – more detailed than what people see in Quake Wars, but that concept – or you could be inside a closed environment and like a haunted mansion or something like that, and every aspect of every character, if you want it to be, can be unique. You’re basically leaving it up to the artist and the art team to decide whit their parameters are. They don’t have to be restricted by the technology anymore. And because it’s such a scalable solution, you don’t really have to worry about where it’s going. We’ve got our tech running on Mac, 360, PS3 PC, and it’s all one asset set and it goes to these different platforms and it runs fine.

On the state of the game industry: Games do take longer to make. And the types of games we make do take more people. … Wolfenstein 3D took a handful of people 6 months to make. Doom took less than a year with less than 10 people. Back then you could come up with an idea and get it into the world really fast.

I remember back in Wolfenstein, when I worked on a character that was taking me more than a week I thought for sure they were going to fire me. Times have changed. You can’t really get anything done in a week because we’re dealing with very complex and detailed things.

It requires artists and designers that have significant talent. These guys could make it in any business. The guys who work here at id could be illustrators, they could work in the movie industry … but they’ve chosen to work in games. So that’s really different than the way it used to be when I first started. But still, on a fundamental level, you’re still creating cool stuff. You’re still bringing things into the world that nobody has ever seen before or thought of before. That aspect is still the same, and I hope that doesn’t change.

On working in games: When I think back about the kind of stuff I was doing as a kid, whether it’s drawing new characters for comic books, or writing up ideas for D&D adventures and stuff … really this is sort of an extension of that. I just get a chance to do it at 42, which is pretty nice.

On John Carmack: When a guy in his spare time [designs a cell phone game] and makes rockets, that’s pretty much all the signs you need to know you’re working with a true genius.

***
Russ Pitts is an Associate Editor for The Escapist. His blog can be found at www.falsegravity.com.

A couple of weeks ago I had the pleasure to hold a virtual round table via conference call with four of the most intelligent, responsible journalists working in the field of games.

N’Gai Craol is an editor at Newsweek and writes for the blog LevelUp. Julian Dibbell has been writing about games longer than any of us, and is currently a freelancer working for The New York Times Magazine, among other places. He’s also the author of the book Play Money. Kieron Gillen is a career freelance game journalist who writes for The Escapist, Edge and other magazines in the U.K. and the U.S. And N. Evan Van Zelfden is also a career freelancer, and has also published in The Escapist as well as The Economist, Kotaku and others.

All four were kind enough to take an hour out of their day to share their thoughts with me on game journalism as a whole, the art of crafting an interesting story about games and how they made into one of the sweetest gigs on the planet.

The following is a partial transcript of the highlights of the discussion that followed. For the full-length audio download, skip to the last page.

***

Julian Dibbell: Writing about games is not the same thing as writing about other cultural forms, it’s really more travel writing. … I think it goes to the fact that understanding, particularly as games move online, what a game is about and how it works isn’t matter of simply playing it. It’s a matter of immersing yourself in a culture or working it as a beat for a while, so that these kinds of stories become the obvious ones.

Kieron Gillen: It’s like being an embedded reporter, isn’t it? I think about Jim Rossignol, writing about Korea, and he went there for a couple of weeks and got stuff you really don’t get from the surface level. There’s some real similarities to travel writing.

Russ Pitts: It’s important to note that Kieron was (for better or worse) the man who coined the phrase New Games Journalism.

KG: I did tell Jim if NGJ gets mentioned I’m hanging up.

RP: I know you’re sick of hearing that, and I bring it up only because that’s a comparison I’ve made myself between game writing and travel writing, and it feels like the meat of what you and Ian and Jim were after. Is that how you think of it? If you could go back in time and erase the bad parts of being the guy who coined NGJ, is that really the essence of what you guys were saying?

KG: It’s clearly something that a lot of people think about games in that way. It’s one of the fruitful ways you can write about games. It’s not the only way to think about games, but it’s quite fruitful.

RP: I want to talk to Evan about this, because I haven’t been to every game convention in the past year – I’ve been to a lot of them – but every one I’ve been to, Evan has been to as well. Evan, do you think of games journalism as travel journalism?

N. Evan Van Zelfden: Definitely. I mean, I was always more interested in developer culture than writing about the games themselves, so one of the things I would do is go to different cities. I toured Dallas, Chicago, Montreal and found that each city has a unique developer culture. It’s because whenever there’s a large company – here Austin had Origin, and Origin closed and everyone went off to start a different company. It’s fascinating. You’ve got these little city states of game developers across the world.

RP: How’s that translate into the work? Going back to the travel journalist metaphor … with game journalism, how do you sell for example, The Economist or The New York Times Magazine an article about games, particularly about a game niche that most people don’t even know exists?

Some suggest, in this digital age of instant information, print media for videogames has been obsolete for years and is only just now finding out. Others suggest print media can still be relevant, as long as it adapts to a changing reality of game journalism. And still others see traditional outlets as the only true professional game reporters on the block.

But, as the game magazine business and its consumers continue to figure out just where magazines belong in the digital age, the bloodletting has been brutal. Where some outlets have been forced to close, others have adapted to survive. The Escapist recently spoke with Jeff Green, Editor-In-Chief of Games For Windows Magazine (previously Computer Gaming World) about his thoughts on staying relevant and the current state of videogame magazines and videogame reporting.

***

The Escapist: So, let’s start big picture. How would you characterize the state of print gaming magazines?

Jeff Green: Well, that’s a pretty broad question, don’t you think? But, OK. I’ll run with it. I’d say the “state” of the print mags is that we are in a period of transition.

We have, over the past few years, ceased to be the primary/first source of information for hardcore gamers, and are now all trying to figure out what that means, then – how to stay relevant, vital or even necessary at all. Not to sound overly pessimistic. But I feel sorry for any magazine folks who haven’t figured this out yet.

On the other hand, don’t get me wrong; I am not at all of the “print is dead” school. I still think print has its place, at the very least for the stereotypical “bathroom, couch, airplane” reasons. And plenty of mags in other entertainment media are finding ways to remain relevant. It can be done – you just have to be smart, creative and open-minded. The old ways won’t work anymore.

TE: It seems like the online component of magazine brands is gaining importance. You participate in a podcast, write a blog and who knows what else on top of trying to produce a monthly magazine. Does this weaken the print end of things by spreading out resources and time or strengthen the entire brand by broadening your base, so to speak?

JG: I think it’s the latter, for sure. I mean, it’s been a “learning experience” with lots of hiccups and growing pains for us, but I think it’s starting to bear fruit now. Wow. That was like three cheesy metaphors all mixed together in one! Maybe I am being spread too thin!

Seriously, we have been consciously pushing the online component for a long time now, and without being a corporate toady about it, I do feel like you can start to see the difference. ZD is very much now as much about the 1UP.com brand as it is with the magazines – we’ve come a long way on that front. And for some of us old-school print guys, there was, of course, a lot of resentment at first. “What, we have to podcast weekly now? WTF is a podcast? And you’re paying us how much extra to do that now? Oh, I see- – nothing! Great! Fuck off!” But we’ve come around to the point where we actually enjoy doing the podcast, at least at our particular magazine. And I think in our case now you are definitely seeing it broaden the base. The popularity of GFW Radio has directly translated into people who had never heard of or cared about or magazine – or even PC games at all – turning into magazine subscribers. That’s about as great a result as we could hope for.

TE: There’s the perception that there’s a lot of instability in the print magazine industry. We’ve seen some high profile outlets like CGM close, we’ve seen your own publication go through an entire brand change, and both PC Gamer and EGM have been the center of public conflicts with developers and fans; this seems like a different environment than just five years ago. Can it all be contributed to the rise of the internet and gaming blogs, or is there more to this change?

JG: I think there is a massive amount of instability – it’s not just a “perception” -and I definitely think it is from the rise of the internet, yes. It’s changed everything, obviously, forever.

But I still stubbornly believe it’s not all over yet, for all of us. At least a couple mags will live long and prosper. And, you know, I think frankly that it’s a good thing that this has happened. Game magazines have sucked for forever now. So fat and lazy. So content just to go for the low-hanging fruit. The online competition has forced magazine editors to start thinking more creatively about what to put in their magazines. I like the challenge a lot.

TE: So, if they’ve been below standard before, how have the challenges of adapting to online competition improved game magazines, and do you think the print sector would be in better shape if the quality of the material had been better all along? I guess that’s a long way of saying, was this turmoil inevitable or was there complacency in the print segments?

JG: Well, first, to continue to be hard on the print magazines (and I am not excluding my own, by the way), I don’t think we’ve all improved nearly enough yet as a response to online competition, but I do think that we have at least been forced to try to improve. Or at least, those of us who have accepted the changing nature of the beast now have tried. Any print guys arrogant enough to think they can still do things the old way are going to deserve their coming irrelevance.

That said, I know that for us, at least, the online competition has forced us to re-examine every single thing we do, from the kind of articles we write, to the games we cover, to the tone and angle we take, and to the timing of when we print things. Everything we do now is measured against the metric of: “How can we do this better/different/deeper than what everyone has already done online, weeks before us?” If we can’t answer that question, then the article doesn’t deserve to be printed. Of course, we still can’t get past the “meat and potatoes” articles of previews/reviews (and message boards whiners to the contrary, these are still, by far, the most popular articles in the magazine), but even with these articles, we can try to filter it through this same truth: A great many gamers will have already read similar articles online.

But it’s not black-and-white either. One thing we’ve also learned, which runs contrary to pretty much everything else I’ve said here, is that a lot of our subscribers don’t read any online gaming sites – and therefore get resentful and angry if we assume too much and don’t print something as a result. They want to read about it in our magazine. So we still need to cover all the basics, all the time, even if we don’t have much more than what was already said online. So it’s a balancing act. And not remotely an exact science yet.

We’re still all scrambling, trying to figure it out. But I am glad to be where I am, where the people above me are totally committed to print/online integration. Because it can work. We’re seeing it work already in some of the bigger mainstream non-gaming sites, Sports Illustrated/SI.com and Entertainment Weekly/ew.com being two great examples. The weekly magazines still totally maintain their relevance/readership, while the online components enhance/broaden the scope while also providing the daily bits that the mags can’t cover.

And to answer the other part of the question, I do think the print mags have long been too complacent, yes, for sure. But I think the print sector would be in trouble regardless. The Internet just changed everything and everyone, and even the best print outlets in the business – The New York Times, to name just one – has taken hits and had to readjust/rethink in response. It was inevitable, and it affects everyone. I guess my point was, in regards to the gaming press, it’s less of a tragedy because the quality has been so lacking that the shakeup is forcing changes that were long overdue anyway.

TE: Some of the print outlets don’t have the management in place to meet the serious challenges in front of them. They kind of keep blowing it. Do you see the split between magazines that are adjusting to the new environment and those stuck in the old mindset as widening or narrowing?

JG: And, hey, I’m not here just to bag on my competitors. Frankly, the less they adapt to current realities, the easier my job gets. They (and I don’t just mean one mag in particular here) also serve as instructional “what not to do” benchmarks for us.

When we see a print mag throw an article out there that’s way late, or has no online component, or covers nothing that hasn’t already been done to death on the websites, we just think: “Okay – let’s make sure we don’t do that when it’s our turn.” And lord knows we still have a long way to go on that, but we’re trying.

So, to answer you directly, I think that the gap may be narrowing in terms of everyone finally starting to figure out they need to do something, but the actual reality now between what has been done by some of us and not been done by others is very wide. Or to put it in a way that sounds less mealy-mouthed: I think those of us who figured it out early enough now have a huge head start over those who are just getting the dim candle over their heads now (if at all).

TE: So switching gears, what are your impressions of the state of online gaming blogs, and do you consider them competition?

JG: Sure, they are competition. If people are reading them, if they are providing decent information/commentary, then they are competition. Again, it’s foolish to dismiss or look down upon anything at this point. Is there a lot of amateur, unprofessional writing? Yeah, sure. But the gaming mags are not exactly The Atlantic, either, so you won’t see me throwing stones in that direction. And some of sites are great. I spend a good deal of my day, every day, reading them all. Even The Escapist!

TE: Is there equilibrium that will be reached between online and print videogame reporting? What do each need to do to improve?

JG: Things will make more sense over time, sure. What do each need to do to improve? If I answer that and everyone listens, then all my competition will get better and shut me out of business! But to try to answer anyway …

Online: I’d say take a little more time to edit and proofread your articles. I just read some truly embarrassing stuff today, from one of the more supposedly “professional” sites. I mean, we’re talking basic grammar here. Don’t swallow every goddamn little crumb of hype that the game companies toss to us, like fish to seals, and post it as if it was some revelatory big scoop. Exercise more critical judgment.

On the print side: Get over yourselves. It’s over. Your reign has ended. Adapt to the 21st century now, or go away forever. You can have a great monthly product that people will be happy to read on buses, planes, couches and restrooms everywhere. But you will be a dinosaur in the tar pits if you don’t adjust your editorial to reflect the fact that, 90 percent or more of the time now, you can’t possibly print something “new” that hasn’t appeared online already. So get creative. Use real writers. Show some depth and give people something beyond the old-school previews/reviews mediocrity mill. This can be a liberating time if you just take the chance.

TE: Since re-branding, how has Games For Windows Magazine been doing? How’s the mood around the office?

JG: Well, people can find us in stores now, so that’s cool. And the mood is quite good here, actually. We’re enjoying both the chance to experiment with more creatively interesting articles, and to goof off so freely on the podcast.

The actual name of the magazine has still not exactly gotten much easier to say without cringing somewhat, and that has not been helped by the less-than-stellar rollout of the entire GFW platform so far, but, hey, far be it from me to bite the hands that feed! I love you, Microsoft!

Seriously, they’ve put up with a lot of grief with us so far, and I am grateful so far that they have kept their word with us about “editorial independence.” I haven’t even gotten a call yet about my last column, in which I flat out said that GFW Live “sucks ass.” But we’ll see. If I disappear suddenly after this interview, you’ll know why.

War. What is it good for? In the world of Cyber Nations, quite a bit, actually.

Cyber Nations is currently the most active of a number of nation-building games popularized by the likes of NationStates, a game that itself was formed as a promotional activity for the creator’s book. Cyber Nations allows the player to develop a nation along any political viewpoint he desires, creating armies and forging alliances all through the 40,000-strong community.

Such an online base who plays daily, create their own content and make their own communities is the kind of thing most game companies would spend millions on. Yet Cyber Nations, which has no advertising or full-time staff, has done nothing of the sort.

The Cyber Nations fans that have sprung up in the past 18 months seem fanatical in their devotion, plotting wars in various factions, keeping track of the latest developments across the virtual world and recording every major historical turning point in frighteningly-detailed wikis.

We asked Kevin Marks, creator and admin of Cyber Nations, to explain the art of internet diplomacy.

***

The Escapist: Firstly, can you describe Cyber Nations to us in your own words?

Kevin Marks: In the most general of descriptions, Cyber Nations is a browser-based game about simulating nation building and management through economic development and defending one’s interests in war. Right now, the game simulates roughly 40,000 active nations. What makes the game great is not the game itself, but the community within it. The community and player interaction that occurs off-site is where the real fun lies. The game itself is just a place to determine who has more bark than bite or not.

TE: Can you tell us about how Cyber Nations got started?

KM: When I was around 13 years old, I came up with a simple world map-based game that involved push pins to indicate captured cities around the world. Whichever player controlled the most cities and resources won the game. When Google launched their Google Maps API publicly in 2005, the things that it allowed programmers to do with their API is what really sparked my interest in building a nation simulation game around the maps.

Initially I had envisioned making the maps the center point of the game, but through issues with providing map markers to represent thousands of nations, the maps eventually became a secondary feature of the game.

TE: Can you tell us a little bit about yourself?

KM: I started Cyber Nations when I was 24. I’m 26 now. I’m married and we just had our first child on March 29, 2007. Cyber Nations sometimes makes me feel like I have two or three full time jobs, but I somehow find time to manage it and work in the real world, too. The only way I’ve been able to manage everything is through the help of the wonderful moderation staff within Cyber Nations. They really stay on top of things and allow me to focus on code related issues, updates and other things.

TE: How interested are you in real-life geopolitical affairs? Are you a politics junkie?

KM: I wouldn’t consider myself a politics junkie, simply because I just don’t have enough time. I try to keep up with current events, but interestingly enough I tend to get a lot of my news and information by visiting the Water Cooler sub-forum in the Cyber Nations forums. When something major happens in the news, there’s always a topic or two there to read about it.

TE: How is Cyber Nations funded? Is it all through donations?

KM: Cyber Nations is funded through donations and through Google Ads that display on the site. I’ve received offers from companies wanting to display banner ads and pop-ups on the site, but I’ve declined all their offers. I just don’t want to clutter up my website like that at the expense of the users.

TE: A lot of people seem to have heard of Cyber Nations through Nation States. There are also some competitors springing up, like Lunar Wars. Do you think it’s inevitable that something will overtake Cyber Nations someday, as Cyber Nations overtook NationStates?

KM: I don’t think Cyber Nations has overtaken NationStates. If you look at the Alexa traffic rankings, NationStates is still active and doing well. I like to think that each site out there provides its own unique “thing” to interest players. I have come across a few copycat sites, which is both an honor that another programmer would be inspired by my work, but at the same time it is disappointing, since it’s not difficult to be creative and create something new instead of copying what’s already out there.

TE: One thing that has really surprised me is the level of devotion of the community. What attracts and keeps players in Cyber Nations, and how did you build up such a big community in 18 months?

KM: I think it has something to do with the fact that something is always happening in Cyber Nations. Every time I log in there is something new going on, one group flexing their muscles and on the brink of war, another group trying to keep the peace, another group getting caught for spying on another alliance. … It’s that kind of excitement that seems to drive new players to the game and keep them coming back.

TE: Speaking of the community, are the key players from the early days still there? Do players come and go a lot?

KM: I’d say there’s a mixture of both. We’ve still got a lot of players that started in the game just days after it launched on January 6, 2006, and have been active in the game ever since. We also get a lot of new users who pass by and don’t stick around for whatever reasons. We’ve got roughly 40,000 active nations, but over 100,000 nations have come and gone since the game started 18 months ago.

TE: The other thing that has really impressed me is the almost fanatical level to which the entire history of the game world has been transcribed and recorded in the wikis. Alliances rise and fall, wars come and go. What has been the defining or most memorable moment in the history of Cyber Nations for you?

KM: The most defining moment for me came in March 2007 during what players have come to call Great War III or GWIII. During times of war where thousands of players engage one another on a massive scale like we saw in GWIII, the game servers have a difficult time staying up with performance. With the site having performance issues during much of March, I stayed very busy with the game and, as I mentioned before, our first child was born on March 29, 2007, so it was both a very busy and exciting time for me.

TE: How far do you go to make the game realistic? For example, only the top 5 percent of nations can get nuclear weapons. What does that say about North Korea?

KM: When developing Cyber Nations on a MMOG scale, it was important to make the game fair. Because of that, some sacrifices were made for gameplay purposes. For example, the 5 percent rule was added because of massive outcry from the
community that the game was too unrealistic with nuclear weapons so readily available and being used on a massive scale like we saw before the 5 percent rule was added.

TE: Where do you and Cyber Nations go from here? Do you have any interest in developing a commercial version of this, or any other game?

KM: Cyber Nations has grown far beyond my wildest expectations for the game when it first started. Of course, I’ll always keep options open for new opportunities that may come for the game, but if things just remain as they are now I’ll be happy with that, too.

My main goal is to continue to provide for Cyber Nations for as long as people are interested in it. Along with Cyber Nations, I’ve got a couple of other browser-based games that I’m working on, even though I have absolutely no time in my schedule to manage. I guess that’s the story of most web developers, though. Too many great ideas and not enough time in the day.

Wizards of the Coast is probably the biggest brand in gaming no one ever thinks about. Despite my years-long affair with Magic: The Gathering, I was surprised to hear from them when they dropped us a line to talk about Gleemax, their new take on social networking. Gleemax, a MySpace-ish networking site based on a three-pillar (games, editorial and community) strategy, isn’t the first to target gamers, but it’s definitely the best-funded. I had a chance to speak with Randy Buehler, WotC’s Vice President of Digital Gaming, about his plans for Gleemax and the future of Wizards of the Coast.

Buehler’s history is deeply rooted in Wizards of the Coast. Before joining them in 1999, he made a name for himself winning Magic tournaments on the professional circuit. He parlayed his experience there into a spot on the Magic development team, building new cards. In 2002, he jumped to the Magic: The Gathering Online team and has since been looking for new ways to expand WotC’s online presence.

The way Buehler sees it, WotC’s traditional delivery model – getting people into hobby stores – is “stable, but it’s aging.” Teenagers just don’t go to Hobbytown USA anymore. Today’s youth are online, he says, and WotC’s two major properties, Magic and Dungeons & Dragons, translate well to the modern web. In an age where the user dictates the experience, games where the world literally changes on the player’s whim seem like a perfect draw for the Web 2.0 junkie.

Gleemax, Buehler says, is a natural extension of both WotC’s web presence and their offline community-building practices. In the past, they’ve launched two major initiatives to get people into hobby shops and to get them playing their games. The first is the large professional Magic tour, which has grown popular enough to birth its own player trading card set, has breathed life into the aging game; over 100,000 people watch the tournaments online. The second was Friday Night Magic, a grassroots movement to actually bring kids into a social setting inside hobby stores, giving them a chance to connect with others who share an interest after-school activities that don’t revolve around sports. Gleemax is attempting to go online with the latter.

Much of the community aspect of the site is based on fostering a similar vibe. The site is going to offer three different experiences. The first is very MySpace-like – social networking, trophy rooms, event calendars for local shops to coordinate with their customers. They’re also giving players a chance to sound off in an editorial capacity, either by reviewing games or blogging about their gameplay experiences, be it a WotC game or a competitor’s. But where Gleemax really separates itself is in the game channel.

In an effort to make Gleemax “the home for gamers,” Buehler wants to people to actually play games on the site. He plans on showcasing indie strategy games to start, branding them with a WotC seal of approval; sort of like the old Nintendo seal. He says the seal can help guarantee only good games make it on the portal. He mentioned Greg Costikyan’s Manifesto Games as a counterexample to the strict method WotC is using, saying, “Just because you have infinite shelf space; you shouldn’t use it.”

In addition to the indie game portal, Buehler wants to feature board games online. WotC owns the Avalon Hill brand, whose name brings joy to the heart of board gamers across the globe. Bringing those games into an online space may recapture a slightly older demographic that’s escaped gaming since starting a family.

As far as money goes, Buehler says WotC plans on making most of its cash by way of the tried-and-true ad-supported model. They’re also considering a subscription-based premium model, which will give users access to special content, and they might charge to play certain games. Similarly to MySpace, Buehler says they don’t plan on charging hobby stores to promote local gatherings. They’re also using the proceeds from Magic Online to develop and prop up the network, so chances are it’ll be around for a while.

If you were to visit the official site right now, you’d be greeted by a giant, green brain, Gleemax himself, floating maliciously in the center of the page, stating, “THESE ARE THE PIXELS I NEED. YOU MUST BE IN THE PICTURE. DO NOT SEND PIXELS THAT ARE ALREADY ON THE INTERNET. I HAVE ALREADY CONSUMED THEM. I WILL AWARD POINTS AS I SEE FIT. YOU WILL GET BONUS POINTS FOR HAVING MORE MINIONS IN YOUR PHOTO.” Gleemax the mascot is actually borne from one of the WotC fan base’s inside jokes: The community has long suggested an alien presence has been pulling the strings of the hobby company, elevating them to 400-pound gorilla status for reasons beyond human comprehension.

In a way, that might explain the decision to go ahead with a social networking site for nerds, a group not exactly known for being social or having a large network of people with which to socialize. It just seems like a risky proposition. But if Buehler, or the giant brain controlling him, does manage to pull gamers together under one banner, he’ll have struck a goldmine and done it in WotC’s name.

WotC plans on officially rolling out a working version of Gleemax by this year’s Gen Con. Until then, the giant brain will remain; floating, making demands … plotting. If Buehler has his way, we may all soon be thralls of Gleemax, but at least we’ll be together.

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Joe Blancato is an Associate Editor for The Escapist. He quotes Wayne’s World and Dr. Strangelove too much. But someday, it will be funny. Oh yes, it will be funny.

To compliment Erin Hoffman’s excellent take on the subject of game design programs at the community college and university level, The Escapist recently contacted Matt Deller, long-time teacher and former a member of the development team behind Neverwinter Nights. Matt is now a high school assistant principal in Southern California’s Pomona Unified school district, and the mastermind behind the nation’s first high school game design program – and the only one fronted by a former developer.

“It was a crack shot to get in [to developing], as I was basically a ‘fanboy,’ for lack of a better term,” Matt recently told The Escapist, “with zero experience in programming/game development, not to mention I was already ensconced in a seven-year teaching career. One day I was teaching Ecology, the next I was working as a designer on NWN 2 with the guys who had made some of my all-time favorite games. Of course, the grass is not always greener on the other side, and I soon learned why the industry turnover rate is so spectacularly high – a topic which prospective game-developers never tire hearing about.”

Deller eventually left Obsidian to take on his assistant principal job, but he looks back on his days as a game developer fondly and hopes to bring a little of his experience to bear on the dreams of his “prospective game developers.” His program features hands-on instruction using Neverwinter Nights‘s Aurora toolset and the toolset for Valve’s Half-Life, as well as occasional lectures from the occasional visiting developer.

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The Escapist: Does your program focus more on the technological skills required for game development or the more esoteric fundamentals of effective design, or both?

Matt Deller: I’d say both. We use a great text, The Art of Producing Games by David McCarthy, Ste Curran and Simon Byron that covers the history of game development, the basics of what goes into designing games and what the industry is like today. The instructor, David Newton, does an excellent job of supplementing the text with his notes and lectures concerning game design. Nothing beats hands-on experience however, and that’s where Neverwinter Nights comes in.

Throughout the semester, students have been learning the basics of Neverwinter‘s Aurora toolset to the point where they will soon submit a final project of a full-length module that follows their original design document. At Diamond Ranch High School, it’s currently “crunch time.”

TE: Some criticism levied at game design programs is that they’re often staffed by folks with little or no actual game design experience. How do you think your program fares in this respect?

MD: At this point in time, find me another high school assistant principal who also has a design credit listed for a Triple-A title and I’ll consider it valid criticism for our respective program. I suspect I won’t hold such a geek-tacular title for long though, with companies discovering new pipelines of talent from law, medicine, engineering and other fields.

Case in point: Ferret Baudoin, NWN 2‘s Co-Lead Designer, dropped out of law school to make games and Obsidian Lead Designer Kevin Saunders obtained a Masters in Physics from Cornell before switching over to game design.

The Escapist: What are your goals in terms of getting kids placed into programs? Furthering their goals for entering game design, or getting noticed by design studios?

MD: Well, it’s our first year in running the course – our goal at this point is to build the program where it is able to incorporate the other venues offered from our “Digital Academy,” like Computer Animation, Programming and Graphic Arts. Having done that, I feel that we can be confident in assisting students to apply for four-year game design programs or to look for work in the industry right after graduation.

TE: Is the program elective-based? And what kind of kids do you draw, demographically speaking, etc.? What percentage are male or female, and how many have played games before coming in?

MD: The program is elective-based, and part of our district’s Vocational Education program. Students must take at least 10 credits in Vocational Education to graduate from high school – they are able to choose from courses like Culinary Arts, Law Enforcement, EMT, Fire Science, Cosmetology, with Game Design now included.

Our requirements for gaining admission into the class are set pretty high. Currently our class consists of juniors and seniors, with 25 percent of the class consisting of female students. Most are avid gamers, the likes of having sold their souls to World of Warcraft many ages ago. I recently brought in Michael Chu, Game Designer for Blizzard, to speak to the class and they almost mobbed the poor guy.

TE: What is it about Neverwinter Nights and Half-Life that makes them particularly well suited for this type of instruction?

MD: We use Neverwinter Nights as our primary toolset – I don’t think that it has an advantage over any other toolset per se, but the fact that there is an enormous amount of community resources available like video tutorials and toolset manuals is the reason why it tops our list. In addition, I worked extensively with it back in the old days, so it made it much easier to provide our instructor Mr. Newton with support whenever he had a particular question.

TE: How receptive are the kids to the games considering they’re about a decade ahead of their time?

MD: Any game really, however often you may find it in the bargain bin, suddenly takes on a new life when it’s introduced in a classroom setting, as it does a fantastic job of breaking up the monotony of traditional instruction. Does the man dying of thirst ponder whether Evian or regular tap water will suffice?

Needless to say, our students are very enthused with both Neverwinter and Half-Life as mediums for game design.

TE: You recently mentioned you believed your students’ perception of gaming has changed. Changed in what way?

MD: High school students used to typically display an abundance of naivet?oncerning the game industry and how games were developed. Students who are in University-level programs for Game Design are a bit more hardened about what the realities are. I’m now starting to see some of that trickle down now to high school students.

This is striking to me because I remember picking up my newly minted copy of Baldur’s Gate in 1997. Playing it was such an incredibly immersive experience because I had no idea of the production that went into making such a game. Now, with company forums for fans, TV programs like G4, Penny Arcade tell-alls and designers gaining rock star-like status, gamers are sure to discover how many donuts their favorite designer crammed down their pie-hole while designing a particular quest or what the company’s restrooms really look like in a programmer’s blog. To me personally, it takes a bit of the magic out of the finished product.

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Russ Pitts is an Associate Editor for The Escapist. His currently unnamed, yet critically unrecognized column appears every Monday at The Escapist Daily. He also blogs at www.falsegravity.com.

Richard Newsome is the plaintiff’s attorney in Hernandez v. IGE, a lawsuit recently filed against the notorious real-money trade company. The Escapist‘s own Alexander Macris, a Harvard-trained lawyer who’s written on virtual reality law, spent some time on the phone yesterday with attorney Newsome discussing the lawsuit.

The Escapist: What’s your background, Richard?

Richard Newsome: I was a federal prosecutor and then worked for a civil litigation law firm. I defended DuPont, Ford Motor Company and other large corporations. Eventually I decided my heart was on the other side, and that I wanted to represent consumers. I’ve been doing that ever since. My firm represents consumers in complex litigation on a contingency fee basis. We’ve done product liability, class action, multi-district litigation. RMT [real-money trade] seemed like an area that none of the consumer lawyers had waded into. It seemed like a worthy cause and we decided to jump in and see if we could help out.

TE: So what is the actual lawsuit – in layman’s terms?

RN: The actual lawsuit is Hernandez v. IGE. We filed it in Miami, where IGE has offices. In layman’s terms, the core of the complaint is a consumer class action for unfair trade practices. Guys like Tony [Hernandez, the plaintiff] have paid their $15 for some entertainment, and IGE is polluting that entertainment. It’s kind of like, if someone pays for a ticket to go see a movie, and if someone else comes in behind them and kicks their seat, you can get them to stop doing that. We’re just trying to get IGE to stop kicking the seats. This is not unlike other consumer complaints where someone has paid for a service, and someone else is interfering with it. It’s really very simple.

TE: What do you hope to achieve with this lawsuit?

RN: We want to make IGE stop kicking the seat – stop polluting the service that’s been paid for. We’re going to get an injunction. We pleaded for money damages, but the No. 1 goal that we really want is to make them stop. And that’s obviously going to be an intense fight.

TE: No doubt about it. What makes you think this will work?

RN: Oftentimes, to me, it seems like the best cases in the court are when an injustice is being done – when somebody isn’t playing by the rules. And that’s what’s happening here. There are clear provisions in the terms of use that everybody agrees to, and IGE is just violating those rules.

TE: So then why haven’t the industry firms or other consumer law firms done this?
RN: That’s a very good question. I think the consumer law firms are simply unaware of the problem. And I think, with respect to the industry, there are pros and cons of filing a lawsuit when your business model could be affected by the outcome, and the uncertainty of that is causing them pause.

TE: That being the case, do you expect the industry to get involved? And if so, as an ally or as an enemy? Or not at all?

RN: I am obviously hopeful that the industry will get involved one way or another as an ally. What I’d like to do is reach out to them to see if we can’t get some support, even if it’s behind the scenes. But publicly it’d be nice to know that Blizzard was behind us. Clearly their resources are getting gobbled up by this. The time CS has to spend chasing down gold farmers, banning accounts and dealing with angry customers – those are huge resources. And to the extent this action can lessen those problems, we’d like them to support us. Our clients love the game and love Blizzard.

TE: Even if you get no help from Blizzard, do you have the resources to win this?

RN: Yes, we do. The bulk of my practice is handling complex litigation for catastrophically injured people. We handle class actions and complex product liability, and we go to trial. The folks on the other side of us on these cases know this. We don’t think twice about putting a million dollars in costs and thousands of hours of attorney time on a contingency fee basis. So if we can’t work out some deal to the benefit of players, we are prepared to go to the mat. And even if we lose, they will spend a ton of dough fighting us.

TE: What if they want to settle, pay you off?

RN: Well, if there’s a way that we can resolve this case quickly so that players have a way to play in a pollution-free environment, then that’s really what we want. If IGE said, “We’re going to agree to stay out of WoW,” then that’d be great. We’re not in this for a settlement that’s only about money. This is about them needing to be a good public citizen.

But if they make us go to trial, then we will collect. A consumer case takes money. My client doesn’t have the money to pay for this. We’re spending our own money and time on this. We’d like to see some of that money recovered, and if they make us go the distance, let’s recover the damages.

TE: How can you enforce this against a Hong Kong company?

RN: You follow the money. Everything goes through the pipeline of Paypal and credit card companies. They have to go through legitimate institutions to further their conspiracy. So we can hit them in the pocketbook. We would take our injunction and enforce it against the payment companies so they can’t do business. That’s a real means to get them where it hurts. If we win, it’s Armageddon for them.

And IGE will try to claim they aren’t liable, that they are just facilitators. But as a former Federal prosecutor, I’ve handled this before. We had drug dealers say, “Hey, I never touched the drugs, so you can’t touch me!” Although it’s usually used by prosecutors in the criminal context, civil conspiracy is a recognized cause of action that lets us get past the shell game. IGE facilitates gold farming, and that’s the conspiracy. And we think the evidence will prove to a jury that they’re liable for it.

TE: So you feel you have precedent on your side?

RN: There’s no other case that’s been filed like this with respect to gold farming, but there is a ton of precedent with consumer protection law that has been created to protect consumers from illegal conduct. The law says you have to be fair and follow the rules, and when you don’t, and you adversely affect other consumers, you’re subject to a law suit being filed against you. It’s very straightforward consumer protection law.

All of the lawyers who’ve approached this have looked at RMT from the jurisprudence of intellectual property. That’s not what this is about. This is about a consumer who makes $8 an hour and for whom $15 a month is his whole entertainment budget. It’s for guys like him that we’re bringing this suit.

TE: What do you think the ramifications of winning this suit would be for the MMOG business overall? Does it introduce concerns over taxes, property ownership, EULAs?

RN: As I said, we are approaching this from a consumer protection standpoint. I don’t have an opinion on IP or tax jurisprudence. For me to give a legal opinion on those issues, I’d have to study them. But from a consumer protection standpoint, we think we can demonstrate that if you’re paying your subscription fee, you have a right to enjoy that experience unpolluted by people who are breaking the rules. I think that’s something everyone can feel good about. I think the players of these games will support us, because this is for them.